TTW's Public Dev Log

[jlf65]

[quote=Mystical Panda]I think all using boosting memory with ENB (UseEffects = false) does is disable hardware level antialiasing; it only allows software level deferred. I haven't checked, but maybe the V has since changed it so it no longer disables it if effects aren't being used.[/quote]

Yes, there are some graphic settings that can be set by ENB separate from the graphics processing, like AA. This can either be set the same as the game or overridden by the AMD/Nvidia control panel settings. In any case, it's not separate extra graphical processing and has no effect on the speed compared to the same setting inside the game options. If ENB sets FXAA to 15, it's exactly the same as setting FXAA to 15 with the game options.

 

[RoyBatty]

Obviously MSAA (NOT FXAA which is vastly inferior particularly with transparency) and AF don't work on your setup at all then, which is why you cannot see the difference.

Here's a screenshot for you to compare image quality, notice distant objects as well. What I can't show in a still image is the absence of pixel crawling.

https://i.imgur.com/zCQep23.jpg

So yes, you are unknowingly spreading false information.

[jlf65]

I turn off all AA of any kind - it gives you up to 50% faster frame rates on the 1050Ti. So whether or not ENB makes a difference depends on AA? Well, that should be part of stating whether or not to use it. So my info IS correct, but only under certain conditions, and HIS info is correct under different conditions.

[darthbdaman]

You should never use it still really. AA and AF are only the most visible part of it. You will see little rendering bugs and stuff.

I repeat, No one should ever use ENB for New Vegas.

You can use it, whatever, but I will always recommend to everyone they stay as far away from that garbage fire as possible

[Mystical Panda]

[quote=darthbdaman]

 

You should never use it still really. AA and AF are only the most visible part of it. You will see little rendering bugs and stuff.

I repeat, No one should ever use ENB for New Vegas.

You can use it, whatever, but I will always recommend to everyone they stay as far away from that garbage fire as possible

[/quote]

What kind of anomalies is it causing rendering wise? I've used it as a 'boost' and only noticed crawlies; a bit more detailed information would be very helpful, not just for me, but others who might be reading this. In order work bring up or work around problems, we need to know the specifics of things- what problems? depth buffer? inhibits cell draws? things like that- other than, it doesn't work for me, so **** it, and everyone who uses it. <--- light hearted humor.

If I may toss this in, it might be wise to put somewhere in a sticky (if it's not already there), "Though many people use ENB for various reasons, we however do not support it." ("nor EVER will", if you want be more 'forceful'). That might be a bit more professional in the long run, rather than, someone says, hey I use this, and right after that, someone else says, I don't. Fractures things more since it seems more like personal opinion (even if based around facts- what facts lead to that conclusion should be shared).

[RoyBatty]

I've already mentioned what it breaks, it breaks any and all image space modifiers. It has issues with transparency. It breaks water displacement so it cannot be used. It cannot be used with shader model 3 shaders.

It's *your* choice to use, but to constantly disregard the fact that it is *not* compatible by half with the vanilla game is both annoying and bullheaded. To recommend it's use knowing these things and denying them is plain stupid.

We don't just dislike or tell people not to use things because we personally don't like them, we do so because they have known incompatibilities and break the game. You're not the ones who provide support year in and year out for the project, we are, and we get awfully tired of explaining these same things over and over again to people who have issues.

[Mystical Panda]

[quote=RoyBatty]



I've already mentioned what it breaks, it breaks any and all image space modifiers. It has issues with transparency. It breaks water displacement so it cannot be used. It cannot be used with shader model 3 shaders.



[/quote]



Do you know why it breaks these things? Or is it just "it happens period?". That's the question I'm asking. Some of us like to get technical. Is it because Joe "x" say it does, and that's that across the board? I'm guessing it's "they have more experience than you. so, uh, buh bye noobie." kinda thing? We ALL know this happens from time to time. Now I'm not trying to debate peoples ideas or attitudes, just trying to help out when and where I can by asking questions and offering suggestions.



In chat you said it disables MSAA (hardware AA) and uses deferred (software AA, which is less efficient). You didn't like the crawlies, and I was wondering if the refresh was high enough, if there would be a problem- to that you replied "dunno". Nothing else was mentioned between me and you regarding this problem. I researched that, and that's also what I mentioned here.



Even though I have 3.0 model shaders and use the boost part I didn't notice the problems that's been referred to (brigher nights, interiors, etc.,.). Now this might be due to using the Reshade, I'm not sure. Might require further testing.



[quote=RoyBatty]



It's *your* choice to use, but to constantly disregard the fact that it is *not* compatible by half with the vanilla game is both annoying and bullheaded. To recommend it's use knowing these things and denying them is plain stupid.



[/quote]



As you say, it's my choice. If it works for me or others, I'm not sure why that's a problem for you or anyone else, other than having a simple difference of opinion since the problems havn't been a "problem" for me so far. They might be in the later. Just haven't come across, or necessarily noticed them yet. I've never asked you to troubleshoot any boost issues I've had other than posting things I've found that works, and might be of use to others. And as for being bullheaded, I'm NOT sure your actually referring to me here, since I'm fairly open about problems and working through issues with anyone I can. Though I can see with some people here, that's not going to be possible. Not compatible with "half the vanilla game"? is that because of image space modifiers being in pretty much all the game? What others problems does it cause to get to this number? If you or anyone else doesn't want to answer,that's fine, BUT that's doesn't make me BULLHEADED.



[quote=RoyBatty]



We don't just dislike or tell people not to use things because we personally don't like them, we do so because they have known incompatibilities and break the game. You're not the ones who provide support year in and year out for the project, we are, and we get awfully tired of explaining these same things over and over again to people who have issues.



[/quote]



As I said, a sticky that says you don't nor ever will support it covers any and all support, and has no relevance in my personal opinion. It seems to work for me, and I've yet to encounter a 'break' because of it. Maybe in time, I'll notice those things when I have time to research it more, and might even come to the same conclusion everyone else has, but, I do have the right to find out for myself? Now about purposely sharing mis-information? I've seen cases here and everywhere else where someone thought they understood something -gave an option- -sharing it often-, was told differently, then when they researched it themselves, they either accepted or reproved. Shouldn't everyone have that same opportunity? If you mean by "supporting" you don't want to discuss it period, that's cool. Is it a problem if others do? As I was saying earlier, with more information, forums members have the ability to help and troubleshoot things better, not just for others, but for themselves also. Speaking of support, I thought that's what everyone on the forums was trying to do? Me and you have two VERY different styles when dealing with people and issues. I'm hoping we can find a middle ground somewhere and work together on things.

[Risewild]

The way I see it. It is not the TTW team job to explain why ENB does what it does. In my opinion if anyone is curious they should ask that in the ENB community.

Several team members said the ENB for Fallout New Vegas doesn't work the same as it does in Skyrim. In FNV it will break a few things that was already said here more than once.

For other knowledge one should ask in the appropriate community.

A TTW Dev Log thread is hardly the place to have these discussions, let's keep this thread being about the work done on the latest TTW version before it is released. Please? *puppy eyes*

[Mystical Panda]

[quote=Risewild]

 

The way I see it. It is not the TTW team job to explain why ENB does what it does. In my opinion if anyone is curious they should ask that in the ENB community.

Several team members said the ENB for Fallout New Vegas doesn't work the same as it does in Skyrim. In FNV it will break a few things that was already said here more than once.

For other knowledge one should ask in the appropriate community.

A TTW Dev Log thread is hardly the place to have these discussions, let's keep this thread being about the work done on the latest TTW version before it is released. Please? *puppy eyes*

[/quote]

Noted. And I agree any discussion outside the original topic is off track. Sorry for the sidetrack- wasn't intended. I don't think I'll have any questions since they're related across the map of games, and not necessarily just TTW related.

[jlf65]

[quote]I've already mentioned what it breaks, it breaks any and all image space modifiers. It has issues with transparency. It breaks water displacement so it cannot be used. It cannot be used with shader model 3 shaders.[/quote]

I've seen the issues with transparency... there's a set of replacement textures on FO3 Nexus that deals with that. I've seen the issue with water displacement... and it's not an issue as I'm concerned. Most people would never even notice. Shader model 3 makes no noticeable difference at all on my video card, so that's not an issue, either. Can you give an example of a "broken" image space modifier? I don't think I can recall one. But yes, pointing this out, my statement that ENB can be completely turned off for video processing was completely wrong. Sorry. That was misinformation.

I think the problems are worth the primary advantage: it frees up space from textures for other game resources. You don't have to choose between crappy textures, buying a $300 to $500 video card, or foregoing half the mods you would normally use. You can keep the textures, buy a $100 video card (or use an AMD APU, and probably other built-in GPUs that rely on shared memory), and still use 130-ish mods (TTW limit, more in FO3).