CROSS-CONTENT DISCUSSION: Armor

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JaxFirehart
Posts: 3003
Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2012 12:33 am

CROSS-CONTENT DISCUSSION: Armor

Post by JaxFirehart » Wed Sep 12, 2012 7:20 pm

I am opening some things for general discussion, I want input from everyone who reads this on various topics listed below. The current goal is to recreate FO3 in the FNV engine while also integrating appropriate upgrades. The question is, what are the appropriate upgrades.


ARMOR

Should certain, appropriate, clothing and armor from NV be integrated into FO3.


Things to consider:

Obviously stuff like NCR outfits and armors would be out of place.

Things like the Combat Armor Mk2 and the Reinforced Metal Armor could make sense if placed in FO3.

FO3 NPCs are going to take major rebalancing no matter what. The DT system ensures that.


My Conclusion:

I am middle of the road on this one, I favor introducing new armors in slowly and carefully.



dandys
Posts: 21
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2012 8:23 pm

I'm for the reinforced armors

Post by dandys » Thu Sep 13, 2012 12:06 am

I'm for the reinforced armors, it adds variety. I definitely don't want fallout 3 enclave armors in New Vegas. One thing to consider T-51b, it's no longer a one/two-per-game armor in NV like it was in Fallout 3, should we upgrade BoS accordingly?


I don't think NPC clothing like republican outfits and cowboy hats would make sense, or gambler outfits, I like the difference between games.


NV Slave clothing yeah that might be all right for Fallout 3 slaves.


I'm sure I didn't touch on everything...



JaxFirehart
Posts: 3003
Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2012 12:33 am

I'm with you on all counts.

Post by JaxFirehart » Thu Sep 13, 2012 1:02 am

I'm with you on all counts. Personally, I would like to upgrade the Brotherhood, them having T-51bs just makes sense to me. If we do that we need to upgrade the T-51bs that we get as quest rewards. We need to start brainstorming how to upgrade them. Haven't looked at the slave clothing, I'm sure it will work in either wasteland.


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steviestevens
Posts: 108
Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2012 12:54 am

I think giving BoS better

Post by steviestevens » Fri Sep 14, 2012 4:27 pm

I think giving BoS better armor should only apply to named BoS npc or maybe even just the Lyon's Pride. the whole thing with the old armor is that they found it in the pentagon. The only problem I see is maybe having to do some kind of retex for outcasts because I doubt they would disband from Lyons and not take their armor with them.



JaxFirehart
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Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2012 12:33 am

Well you make a good point

Post by JaxFirehart » Fri Sep 14, 2012 5:37 pm

Well you make a good point about outcast themed T51bs. If we need to, I think chuck might be able to do retextures, I know he is good with photoshop. If we only give T51bs to named BoS that would definitely be the easy way out. I read up on the wikipedia about the citadel, it says "its sub-levels remained intact and contained enough pre-war technology and weaponry to keep Brotherhood forces going indefinitely." No source was listed but that implies that the pentagon was well stocked and it would actually make sense to stock the pentagon with the most up-to-date technologe.



yukichigai
Posts: 58
Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2012 1:28 am

The only substitution I would

Post by yukichigai » Sat Sep 15, 2012 8:25 pm

The only substitution I would recommend making is Leather Armor for Leather Armor, Reinforced in the CW, since NV Leather Armor is significantly weaker than the FO3 version.  Leather Armor, Reinforced has roughly the same level of protection as the FO3 Leather Armor.


The rest I would say should absolutely NOT be included in the Capital Wasteland, at least as part of the base mod.  With so much variety (and varying levels of protection) it would dramatically alter gameplay balance.


Oh yes, another note: Raider Armor in the CW needs to be improved significantly.  Right now Raiders are pathetically easy to kill, compared to their original FO3 incarnations.  Something with an 8DT at least



JaxFirehart
Posts: 3003
Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2012 12:33 am

yukichigai wrote:

Post by JaxFirehart » Sat Sep 15, 2012 10:16 pm

[quote=yukichigai]


The only substitution I would recommend making is Leather Armor for Leather Armor, Reinforced in the CW, since NV Leather Armor is significantly weaker than the FO3 version.  Leather Armor, Reinforced has roughly the same level of protection as the FO3 Leather Armor.


[/quote]


You seem to be against any form of integration I've noticed. I did most of the balance changes in the last iteration of TTW, which had almost full integration, and it seemed to come together perfectly. The only people that even got the reinforced armors were merchants because almost every group of enemies was assigned a specific type of armor (Raiders used raider armor, talon company used talon combat armor etc).


[quote=yukichigai]


Oh yes, another note: Raider Armor in the CW needs to be improved significantly.  Right now Raiders are pathetically easy to kill, compared to their original FO3 incarnations.  Something with an 8DT at least


[/quote]


Any changes made to the raider armor would also change the FNV stuff, and that is not something I ever intend to do without having dire need to do so. We could create special dc raider armor, but this creates more unique fomids, more unique formids ruins mod compatibility; and it begs the question: why are DC raiders so much tougher than fiends? That said, I don't remember raiders being that hard to kill in FO3 and I'm not a power gamer, cheater or exploiter. I think I might need to go back and play FO3 anew and get a fresh impression.



steviestevens
Posts: 108
Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2012 12:54 am

The raiders weren't ever that

Post by steviestevens » Sun Sep 16, 2012 2:20 am

The raiders weren't ever that hard unless u had to go against a bunch of them, plus how tough do they really need to be? Fiends arent tough neither are jackals, vipers, ect. I dont see a need to change raider armor or leather armor. Whatever the armor setup was in the initial TTW was fine imo, let's just stick to that. Things like weapons and creatures are one thing but we dont need to make things like armor more complicated than they nee to be, atleast not from the get go.



dandys
Posts: 21
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2012 8:23 pm

I have to say I don't

Post by dandys » Mon Sep 17, 2012 12:56 am

I have to say I don't think that raising the DT on raider armor is the solution to making them more difficult. Raiders use armor in relatively poor condition so the difference between 4 and 6 DT or whatever when condition is factored in may be 1 DT or less What may be able to make them harder is a health boost? I don't know if we'd do that though.

I get why reinforced leather armor would be good in the capital wasteland from a balance perspective, but I don't think it'd fit with the feel of the game. Like you'd think why does everyone have reinforced and no one has regular? A possible solution might be to bridge the gap a little and beef up regular leather armor (for instance if regular is 6 DT and reinforced is 10 making regular 7-8 and a little more expensive).



JaxFirehart
Posts: 3003
Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2012 12:33 am

I like the idea to beef up

Post by JaxFirehart » Mon Sep 17, 2012 1:07 am

I like the idea to beef up their health, I also want to try to give them some better weapons to make them a bit more threatening. I am very against tweaking anything that was found in the standard FNV, so I would rather not alter leather armor at all. What about making it appear in better condition? That would give it a DT boost without actually having to alter the armor.



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