TTW 3.2. How do I go to New Vegas?

General discussion of Tale of Two Wastelands
Death_Reaper56
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Re: TTW 3.2. How do I go to New Vegas?

Post by Death_Reaper56 » Tue Aug 10, 2021 9:09 pm

Laclongquan wrote:
Tue Aug 10, 2021 2:07 pm
I will note that the "ruins thematic" doesnt work for train station, both in Capital Wasteland and Mojave.

Oh, it can works on neighboring cells, if that really what you set your heart on.

But on the cell that contain the train object, the tracks, and maybe the ticket-selling location I would suggest that you remove all the rubbles. The why is a long article I doubt you want to read now, though at half of a gesture from you I will push out that wall of text.

But in a short sentence, please dont leave rubbles, rusts, wrecked train, ruined tracks in the same room with our main objective, which is the Two-Wasteland Train.
So,did you miss the part where everything is supposed to be ruined because of the great war or what? The train station is SUPPOSED to be ruined because that's what happens when a huge war breaks out. The station is fine and the ruins theme works just as well as it does everywhere else.

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Laclongquan
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Re: TTW 3.2. How do I go to New Vegas?

Post by Laclongquan » Wed Aug 11, 2021 2:23 am

Which is why I said neighbouring cells/rooms can work, if you still want to use that theme.

I also note that the Columbus circle, the field outside, is hardly "ruins". At least, it's nowhere near as dense as the interiors.

But this issue relate to several important points surround The Train

- The Train, in fact, is one of the most important function, feature, object of Tale of Two Wasteland content. Its importance transcend the concept of Capital Wasteland. You can say it overflow, overwhelm the concept of "ruins thematic".

- In fact, the interior of the train prove that point: it's hardly ruined, isnt it?

- Thus once people get to The Train, there's no longer any need for ruins theme. You dont need to make it sparkling clean, but you dont want ruins surround it either.

- There's an internal suspension of disbelief: can this train in ruin run an intercontential trip, linking Two Wasteland together? You just dont need that suspension, you can avoid it by making the Train, and its immediate station room, halfway functioning, halfway clean, etc...

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Risewild
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Re: TTW 3.2. How do I go to New Vegas?

Post by Risewild » Wed Aug 11, 2021 4:06 am

I don't think we'll be changing the clutter and rubble on the cell. That would be using time and effort that's better used for more important stuff like fixing bugs or optimizing TTW.

Many pre-war machinery (including much more fragile ones and ones that haven't been sealed since the bombs fell) still work perfectly in the games even when surrounded by rubble and ruins.
For example, why is it that the RobCo facility mainframe is still fully functional and powered since the bombs fell, when it's in a building that's falling apart (full of rubble everywhere, decaying and broken doors, ceiling collapsed in several places), full of mutated critters, the entire building is unlocked and prone to looting, etc?
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Vlan
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Re: TTW 3.2. How do I go to New Vegas?

Post by Vlan » Wed Aug 11, 2021 7:36 am

Are you by chance planning to add a little quest which informs the Lone Wanderer about the train station in DC?

Like for example a short, but looped radio message of a group of people informing other people about a working train which can bring everyone out of here in DC, or just a normal NPC adventurer who travelled through the DC ruins for some time, telling you about his findings in DC. I always have a problem reaching the station in my roleplay playthroughs, because, when I am done with a certain stage in the main quest (fuck you dad), I just want to leave this hellhole, and you certainly do not do that by entering DC (unless of course you know that there is a reliable way to get out of here, which would bring the mentioned quest/info in play).

I think the whole implementation of leaving DC -> NV is not well done on this aspect in TTW (no offense, the dungeon and new interiors look really good).

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Laclongquan
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Re: TTW 3.2. How do I go to New Vegas?

Post by Laclongquan » Wed Aug 11, 2021 11:21 am

You just made, precisely, a good argument in MY favour~
Risewild wrote:
Wed Aug 11, 2021 4:06 am
For example, why is it that the RobCo facility mainframe is still fully functional and powered since the bombs fell, when it's in a building that's falling apart (full of rubble everywhere, decaying and broken doors, ceiling collapsed in several places), full of mutated critters, the entire building is unlocked and prone to looting, etc?
You see, the mainframe is the central point of that building. A super computer which allow you to get locations of vaults. The other one that can serve such function is a normal one in the library of Citadel which is LATE game access.

And what's in its immediate surrounding? Clean office. Dust-free, that is the imagination of that room's theme.

They can leave other part of that location in ruins, which is how you can treat other rooms in a columbus station.

But the central part, the soul of a location, is... true to its role in the whole thing, its design. Imagine if they did put a bunch of rubble in the immediate room of the terminal.

THE TRAIN is the soul, not solely, but at least a very important part of Tale of Two Wasteland. It serve a very big function. Which it need special treatment.
Last edited by Laclongquan on Wed Aug 11, 2021 12:20 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Risewild
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Re: TTW 3.2. How do I go to New Vegas?

Post by Risewild » Wed Aug 11, 2021 11:26 am

Vlan wrote:
Wed Aug 11, 2021 7:36 am
Are you by chance planning to add a little quest which informs the Lone Wanderer about the train station in DC?

Like for example a short, but looped radio message of a group of people informing other people about a working train which can bring everyone out of here in DC, or just a normal NPC adventurer who travelled through the DC ruins for some time, telling you about his findings in DC. I always have a problem reaching the station in my roleplay playthroughs, because, when I am done with a certain stage in the main quest (fuck you dad), I just want to leave this hellhole, and you certainly do not do that by entering DC (unless of course you know that there is a reliable way to get out of here, which would bring the mentioned quest/info in play).

I think the whole implementation of leaving DC -> NV is not well done on this aspect in TTW (no offense, the dungeon and new interiors look really good).
Well, the TTW lore for the DC train station is that it entered lockdown when the bombs fell, and soon after it got used as a Super Mutant camp. So there's probably no one alive that knows it's a train station. Since the actual train platforms haven't been entered by anyone since the apocalypse happened (because all the armored security doors are locked and unpowered since the bombs).

Which makes it hard to explain how anyone knows that it's a train station, or that it did interstate train trips, or anything else about it's pre-war purpose. I guess wastelanders could know it's a Super Mutant camp, but little else. :?

The roleplay about it could be that the Lone Wanderer happens to stumble on it and after clearing it finds that there's a functional train and decides to see where it leads or something.

We had plans for a pre-war advertising about Vegas and the station, but it didn't work very well in the past, I don't know if the team will try to implement it later again or not though.
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Vlan
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Re: TTW 3.2. How do I go to New Vegas?

Post by Vlan » Wed Aug 11, 2021 4:01 pm

Risewild wrote:
Wed Aug 11, 2021 11:26 am
Vlan wrote:
Wed Aug 11, 2021 7:36 am
Are you by chance planning to add a little quest which informs the Lone Wanderer about the train station in DC?

Like for example a short, but looped radio message of a group of people informing other people about a working train which can bring everyone out of here in DC, or just a normal NPC adventurer who travelled through the DC ruins for some time, telling you about his findings in DC. I always have a problem reaching the station in my roleplay playthroughs, because, when I am done with a certain stage in the main quest (fuck you dad), I just want to leave this hellhole, and you certainly do not do that by entering DC (unless of course you know that there is a reliable way to get out of here, which would bring the mentioned quest/info in play).

I think the whole implementation of leaving DC -> NV is not well done on this aspect in TTW (no offense, the dungeon and new interiors look really good).
We had plans for a pre-war advertising about Vegas and the station, but it didn't work very well in the past, I don't know if the team will try to implement it later again or not though.
That sounds like a great start. What exactly was not working with it?

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Risewild
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Re: TTW 3.2. How do I go to New Vegas?

Post by Risewild » Fri Aug 13, 2021 11:39 am

Vlan wrote:
Wed Aug 11, 2021 4:01 pm
That sounds like a great start. What exactly was not working with it?
It broke the spawn system or something like that. :lol:
I brought it back up to the rest of team now, and we're thinking on different ways of putting it back ingame without breaking anything. We'll probably have to simplify it quite a bit.
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Vlan
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Re: TTW 3.2. How do I go to New Vegas?

Post by Vlan » Fri Aug 13, 2021 3:20 pm

Risewild wrote:
Fri Aug 13, 2021 11:39 am
Vlan wrote:
Wed Aug 11, 2021 4:01 pm
That sounds like a great start. What exactly was not working with it?
It broke the spawn system or something like that. :lol:
I brought it back up to the rest of team now, and we're thinking on different ways of putting it back ingame without breaking anything. We'll probably have to simplify it quite a bit.
Lol, how did that even happen. :lol:
I am intrigued now. Anyway, thanks for bringing it back to the table!

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Laclongquan
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Re: TTW 3.2. How do I go to New Vegas?

Post by Laclongquan » Fri Aug 13, 2021 4:00 pm

I note that having Muties holding the station is not... realistic, as I hate to use that word.

Muties are not very smart and have tendency to break things. AND they like to decorate with gore bags. Clean up the station would have a been stone cold son of a mutt. :lol:

MEANWHILE you have Talon company just sitting there. They are humans, so they know the importance of train and tracks. Also not in the habit to uglify their captured buildings. :ugeek:

Having Talon company holding the entry, with Super Mutants holding the surroundings would be a more intrigueing scenario. :o
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Another total different scenario would be a team of Brotherhood of Steel holding that area as forward base to support the teams attacking White House.

Since they are having a bit of a tiff with West Coast BOS, so they dont send train westward. But considering we are having a history with them (project purity in the past and current year) they just might allow us to piggyback onto their train.
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Extra difficult would be team of BOS holding station, Talon holding the buildings, and Muties in the open. All three can have a grand melee, ala Capitol West Gate style~

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