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DoctorEvil
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Disappointed

Most of my points I made in my steam review...

****SPOILERS****

I bought this game out of pure hype, I will not make this mistake again with Bethesda games. Rather than following up on what made New Vegas epic, Bethesda takes a step back and pretty much does what it does. Bugs all around, poor optimization and occasional FPS drops (I'm running this on a GTX 980 TI with a core i-5 4670k), but that's to be expected. Still, it's far smoother than its predecessors.

The intro is nice, and I really enjoyed the opening vid, but it doesn't really invest you in the characters... When your spouse gets shot, I don't really care, because I don't know her that well. Bleh.

Oh, and as for making the player voice acted, it's pretty much all you can use to tell what you're saying. Bethesda decided it would be a good idea to copy Bioware's dialogue wheel, and we get the same problem as Mass Effect had: We don't know what the ♥♥♥♥ we're saying, and we get only four options on this wheel (sarcastic, yes, maybe, investigate). Seriously? 

I'm not all up in arms about Bethesda using the same engine, but it's clear that it's at its use's end. The graphics are basically what New Vegas looks like with ENBs and a ♥♥♥♥♥on of tex packs. The engine still is very limiting, I'd much rather they create a new one or just use Unreal 4.

Let's discuss controls... There are very few graphic options to play with and it forces you to use features like DoF and Motion Blur... which I hate vehemently. No option for v-sync, and a lot of other issues right there. Also apparently it forces mouse smoothing, which also sucks

As for the gameplay features, gunplay is improved and I love the idea of customizeable armor and weapons, but it's clear that's the only feature of this game that's a true step up over the previous fallouts. The crafting system is a wonderful idea, but the UI is extremely clunky and it's frustrating as hell. Companions I still have yet to assess, but the interaction with the dog is only to tell it where to go, what to do, and it's a bit distracting especially when you're in the middle of combat.

Story: Right out of the gate, I love the premise of being in the era of when the nukes it, perfect set up, and being frozen in time also adds to that. Now, I have only played for a couple hours so I'm not sure, but I am already seeing traces of classic Bethesda story and characters - One dimensional and not nearly as endearing as what Obsidan cooked up.

So in all, if you want this game, wait till the price drops, and also wait for some mods. I seriously hope someone comes around and scraps that awful dialogue utility, or even just port New Vegas onto here.

Well, that's it. I'm still gonna play this game, but it's clear some mods are needed to truly make this game into the masterpiece it should have been.

I'm hoping once you all are done with TTW you guys work on a way to port New Vegas onto here.

TTW Version Compatibility: 

v2.9

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Edited by: DoctorEvil on 11/10/2015 - 09:14
TJ
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I just wanna say I'm too poor

I just wanna say I'm too poor for NVidia GPU and Intel CPU, I've only got an AMD FX6300 and an R9-290 and in 20 hours or so I've *NOT* dropped below 60fps, not once.

On the intro: Based on your opinion, I'd say you aren't married and don't have a kid. Fallout 1 & 2 fans are now grown and have families (for the most part) so maybe that's something to consider.

The graphics are nice, with some exceptions.

I have encountered some minor bugs, but far less than your average Bethesda game.

As for the interface, you said it: mods.

All in all, I think the game is fine. I did not buy it based on hype. I bought it because.... it's Fallout. I'd have bought it regardless. Also I'm a fairly skilled modder, I can fix most of my complaints, given a mod manager.

There's no way FNV / TTW is getting ported in the forseeable future. Some of the points you mentioned, like dialog, are why.

Also, for what it's worth, some of us fellas around here have already dug into the plugins / archives despite a lack of tools. Cool things coming that weren't possible with the other games.

"In the world of entertainment, there are very few things as good..... as Fallout."

"... That's why we're going out of our way to make our game less Fallout."

DoctorEvil
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Well now that I've gotten out

Well now that I've gotten out of spooner town or whatever it's called, everything is running fine.

And yeah, I'm unmarried and I don't have kids :D. I get what you're saying there, however.

The graphics I compare to how New Vegas looks when souped up on Enbs and texture packs, kind of minimal difference other than that New Vegas has more graphics customization.

 

TJ
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Wasn't trying to knock your

Wasn't trying to knock your opinion, just provide a counterpoint. For those who haven't purchased, the main thing to remember is: It's a Bethesda game. Less so than the last few, but still.

"In the world of entertainment, there are very few things as good..... as Fallout."

"... That's why we're going out of our way to make our game less Fallout."

DoctorEvil
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Well my issue is that

Well my issue is that Bethesda games are mistaken for RPGs when they are more like action/adventure games with RPG mechanics tacked on. They definitely improved, but the lack of hardcore mode and having only 4 dialogue options with the same options each time they come up isn't something I'm proud of. Also I'm missing the companion wheel now

I really wish they had let Obsidian have their fun with Fallout again, because those guys really know how to make RPGs and quality games.

TJ
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Every Beth game has been less

Every Beth game has been less RPG than the last, I agree with you entirely there.

"In the world of entertainment, there are very few things as good..... as Fallout."

"... That's why we're going out of our way to make our game less Fallout."

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DoctorEvil wrote:

DoctorEvil wrote:

 

Well my issue is that Bethesda games are mistaken for RPGs when they are more like action/adventure games with RPG mechanics tacked on. They definitely improved, but the lack of hardcore mode and having only 4 dialogue options with the same options each time they come up isn't something I'm proud of. Also I'm missing the companion wheel now

I really wish they had let Obsidian have their fun with Fallout again, because those guys really know how to make RPGs and quality games.

They arent mistaken. They ARE RPG's no matter how you look at it. And Obsidian did have their fun with Fallout. It's called New Vegas. They're more then likely handle the next game if it's Fallout 5 or New Vegas 2 or whatever.

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They arent mistaken. They ARE

They arent mistaken. They ARE RPG's no matter how you look at it.

Less and less RPG with each new release though.

Even Beth said this Fallout game is about the player watching a story being told, it should be about making it's own story. Role Playing is getting less and less time in Beth "RPG"s.

Again Bethesda is known for not being able to make real RPG stories and quests and so the way I see it they just stopped trying and focused on what they can do like no other, world building, they can make a world be beautiful and feel interesting even without a good story.

For example some people consider games that have level up as RPGs others don't, I am old and played plenty of P&P RPGs and old computer ones and even some of the jRPGs and I can say tha tjusy because one can level up in a game does not mean it is an RPG, RPG means role playing game and it is where the player role plays to become a character, the player has choices, can play the game in a way his character would actually react, being forced to do things over and over even if my character wouldn't do them breaks the role playing game type for me and makes it more like an action adventure game. On this note I say that to be honest most video games and computer games these days are not even close to RPGs they all force the player to do certain things the way the game wants and not the way the player wants, limitations of hardware compared to real life players and a GM? definitely but also there is a laziness by part of devs, some old games like the over talked, over compared to Baldur's Gate saga, Planescape torment and even the first Fallout games did allow for character liberties and freedom in a much superior way than today's RPGs, one could play as a really goody two-shoes, a good but also a bit bad person, a total neutral, a evil with a bit of good, or really totally evil character and the games did accounted for all of these options.

Times change and game styles change too, maybe I am stuck in the past and am starting to become like those old geezers on tv shows that say it was all better in their days, but I am sure devs cared more about the freedom of the player choices and game styles back then than now... Essential characters anyone? None of the Fallout games I mentioned had essential characters, want to kill anyone? even if they give quests? No prob, kill them and just live with the consequences .

Sorry, I guess I am in a grumpy mood since everyone is enjoying their FO4 except me.

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I'm disappointed that Beth

I'm disappointed that Beth completely ignored FNV when creating the game. Say what you want about which game was better, or which story was better, the ideas in play in FNV blow any fallout game before or after away.... save the first two. Wonder if that was a coincidence.

"In the world of entertainment, there are very few things as good..... as Fallout."

"... That's why we're going out of our way to make our game less Fallout."

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Just like in the original

Some things they should have learned from the reactions to the other games seem to have sailed right on over.  For one example, just like in the original 1st person FO games under Beth until someone invented balance mods, I find myself shooting these guys right in the face 7-8 times and they don't even stagger. I deliberately went into god mode and stood myself right in front of one of them and shot him 14 times using VATS, at least half of them head shots, before bringing him down. This isn't gonna cut it.

Also, every raider I've seen so far looks exactly the same, is dressed exactly the same... the lip syncing is virtually non existent. And coming up against an almost totally indestructible deathclaw at level 3 with nothing but a 10mm pistol was a real joy. (NOT!)

It's like taking a huge step backward, like we're right back at the beginning of Fallout under Bethesda only with even fewer choices, even worse graphics and even less in the way of reality and immersion at least on mid range rigs like mine. I'm figuring it will get better as the tools become available and the high end modders start working with it but as another commenter said elsewhere, right now I'm about ready to shut her down and wait until that happens simply to keep my first play through from being a total flipping mess.

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For those of you saying it's

For those of you saying it's a step backward, I strongly encourage you to dust of a Fallout 3 disc from version 1.0 - make sure it's completely unpatched - and play Fallout 3 with no mods and no patches. 

Then come back and tell me Fallout 4 (which we are playing unmodded, unpatched) is a step backward.

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If you can even get it to run

If you can even get it to run.

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Just a note about something

Just a note about something the OP said:

here are very few graphic options to play with and it forces you to use features like DoF and Motion Blur

There seem to be options for at least disable Motion Blur in the FO4 advanced Graphic Options:

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You can turn off DoF, Motion

You can turn off DoF, Motion Blur and other effects in the Prefs.ini

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I downloaded a set of tweaked

I downloaded a set of tweaked ini files that solved a lot of my problems and did some more tweaking on my own and have the game looking and playing a lot better now.  In fact, I'm actually enjoying it now.   

But I'll tell you what... I'm sure going to be glad to see you guys cut loose on it when the tools come out.  So many things I had grown to take for granted in the other FO games, especially after I got TTW... like I find myself thinking, Oh hell, I can fix that in the editor and then I realize there IS no editor yet.

Still don't like a lot of things about the UI and don't understand why you can find real firearms in DC and the Mojave but not in The Commonwealth but that's probably got more to do with it being different than with it being bad.  Definitely warming to it now.     

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Nofsdad wrote:

Nofsdad wrote:

I'm sure going to be glad to see you guys cut loose on it when the tools come out. 

Me too.

"In the world of entertainment, there are very few things as good..... as Fallout."

"... That's why we're going out of our way to make our game less Fallout."

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I am quite disappointed with
I am quite disappointed with the story on this one. There's no real option for character specialization because at the max level, everything is unlocked and there is nothing to differentiate your playthrough. The only real options are whether you want a male or female character. I haven't had to make a single difficult choice in the game and it's bothering me. The motivations for the characters are also flimsy at best. Their voice acting and character animations are a lot better and I experienced way less bugs. But they never really had anything interesting to say. One quest that comes to mind is one that I encountered early on at a quarry. Some dude wanted me to fix some pipes but never explained why they needed fixed or what he was even doing. So...yeah. All he had to tell me was "fix the pipes and it's some monies for you." The Brotherhood of Steel also bothered me. Their motivations make no sense. They are just like "the synths are bad! Synthetic humanoids are evil things that wish to destroy mankind!" But at this point, I'm just not seeing it. We're never really shown just how brutal they are. We see how much they make people afraid, sure, but not WHY they are afraid. This gets even weirder when you consider what the Brotherhood is originally all about: hoarding technology. Buuuut that's not the case here again. They're being the good guys of the story instead of a neutral faction. And the funny thing is, they chide Elder Lyons of FO3 for doing this! The new Elder badmouths Lyons for a solid five minutes because he was a "fool" and "not dedicated to securing technology". But when you look at it, their goal is exactly the same: cleaning up the world. My weapons still feel like BB guns though. In fact for a few weapons the melee strike does more damage (??). Also weird is that some of the stock mods alter damage for some reason. The world feels even smaller than NV.
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The world is smaller than NV,
The world is smaller than NV, even with NV having that hole side of the map ripped out. I'm not sure how far along I am in the main story, but I just now got past the glowing sea. I wish I had more reason to want to get my son. I'm not married nor have children, but even still they didn't do setting up the story justice. I will say I haven't wanted to be an evil person like in past fallout games, probably because I don't see it being helpful. All in all, it feels a lot like a massive point lookout, thankfully there's not too many Boston accents though. Can't stand that.

"If violence wasn't your last resort, you failed to resort to enough of it"

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I've been RPing heavily and

I've been RPing heavily and as such I can see where my character's motivations come from. The brotherhood don't need to explain their backstory, as they have 4 previous games of back story. Synths are sufficiently advanced technology. The Brotherhood covets sufficiently advanced technology. They also tend to take sufficiently advanced technology, by any means. You covered that in your summary though, so really when it gets down to it maxson deems the institute sufficiently advanced enough to be a threat to humankind, what with the body snatching and the synth replacements.

"In the world of entertainment, there are very few things as good..... as Fallout."

"... That's why we're going out of our way to make our game less Fallout."

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eezstreet a lot of the quests

eezstreet a lot of the quests have back ground information for them hidden in terminals and holotapes. The quarry quest is tied into a larger group of quests for that area and once you find it all it gives a great back story into what has and is going on for several groups through that region. 

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I was excited at first.

I was excited at first.

Wow'd at the presentation Bethesda gave.

Preordered a Pip-boy version as soon as I could.

Gleeful at the install and start of the game.

Now, after about 3 hours of play (and 1 character restart) I am disappointed. The UI is horrible, truly the worst UI of any modern Bethesda game. Even Skyrim had a better UI for being so console centric. WASD the "E" key... and the "Enter" key? What octopus did Bethesda make this game for? And if your a lefty and map to the arrow keys, then it's the "tab" key is your culprit. :facepalm:

It's not all doom and gloom though, I haven't experienced any bugs in my playtime so far, so that's at least good.

Bethesda seemed to listen and not to complaints about the prior games for some things, the intro is fairly short (comparied to F3) however this is both a blessing and a curse in my mind. With not enough time to "bond" with your spouse, so right off the bat, I don't care for this protagonist's plight at all. One thing that threw me out of the game immersion wise was why would your character "thaw" for that brief moment in time to witness the said event? It makes no sense, and they seemingly go right back "under" to get put on ice right after?

Perhaps it's too early for a real judgement, I will try more, but color me very unimpressed so far.

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AnvilOfWar wrote: One thing

AnvilOfWar wrote:

One thing that threw me out of the game immersion wise was why would your character "thaw" for that brief moment in time to witness the said event? It makes no sense, and they seemingly go right back "under" to get put on ice right after?

They explain what happened later.

"In the world of entertainment, there are very few things as good..... as Fallout."

"... That's why we're going out of our way to make our game less Fallout."

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I think Preston is going to

I think Preston is going to go down as the most annoying NPC in Fallout 4.  I can not go to Sanctuary without him giving me like 1-2 rescue Community Missions.  Yes sometimes I get 2!!  Spent that last two hours in game just getting one mission after another after another... after another!... I want to shoot him.  I can not even officially complete them without him giving me another, and another, and another.  If I finally do I think I will send him to a location in which I never visit so will not have to worry about him randomly walking by me giving me another mission. LOL

Literally trying to avoid him like a old GF.  lol

"You are only lost if you give up on yourself." Hans-Ulrich Rudel

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I saw it coming, I built

I saw it coming, I built Sanctuary a bit, then left him there.

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Bethesda has a vice president

Bethesda has a vice president in charge of making annoying NPC's.  Obsidian borrowed the guy to create Malcolm Holmes, Mr. Holdout, Jacklyn and Tomas. He then returned to Bethesda for Skyrim, where he flourished.

My computer specs are too embarrassing to reveal, but the game still runs.

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It got so damned annoying

It got so damned annoying that when Sturges managed to stand upright long enough to ORDER me to build beds for him and the rest I immediately went back to a save where we were just leaving the museum and this time I stopped at the truck stop.  Haven't returned to Sanctuary and don't intend to.

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Nofsdad wrote:

Nofsdad wrote:

It got so damned annoying that when Sturges managed to stand upright long enough to ORDER me to build beds for him and the rest I immediately went back to a save where we were just leaving the museum and this time I stopped at the truck stop.  Haven't returned to Sanctuary and don't intend to.

I'm ignoring the quest Preston is giving me with a "new" save game. I went just far enough to where Sanctuary works like a settlement with preston being available as a companion *and i can command him to do jobs at Sanctuary* and everything works.  So now I just have Sanctuary, the Red Rocket station, and a Farm to worry about, and it's been well, quiet.  I likely haven't gone far enough into the Minutemen quest line to be bothered with raids/attackers.  So I'm pleased.

So saying this.  If anyone wants to "build" stuff at Sanctuary, and still get all the benefits of a "Community" of your own.  Just do the first "Farm" recruitment Quest for Preston, he will call you General after it is over and become a Companion.  You should have 3 communities... then just ignore everything else Preston gives you after that, as they don't seem to be "timed" missions.  And Walla, you have Sanctuary and the Red Rocket Station to have fun building on, without much of the worries/irritation.  Getting Artillery/Mortar strike capability personally just isn't worth the headache of helping the Minutemen personally.  

"You are only lost if you give up on yourself." Hans-Ulrich Rudel

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Even if you don't stop

Even if you don't stop expanding, it seems that only the outer settlements will ever get hit hard - I've had virtually no problems with Sanctuary being attacked ever, despite having 333 units worth of water purification and only 72 defense from strategically tower-placed turrets. (I did not build any walls or fences, but instead I have overlapping turret kill zones on the perimeter.)

Note: Industrial Water Purifiers and a bazaar of shop emporiums (where to sell all that water to) are a nice way to make some extra caps in the game, a steady income of sorts. Of course this requires some investment in the right perks like at least Scrapper, Science, Local Leader 2 and Cap Collector 2 (Medic perk if you also want to have a Surgeon Centre shop, which can be useful for the meds and doctor services). With the Water Purification 333 and 20 population I seem to be getting something like over 4300 bottlecaps from selling the water produced every few ingame days (thats for getting paid 14 caps per bottle of purified water).

 

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Hi all,

Hi all,

I just wanted to comment on some of the posts made above. I started playing FO4 the day it came out and have become throughly addicted. It is the greatest Fallout game I can remember. As far as performance, I have been playing with an AMD FX-4130. I had to upgrade my power supply and graphics card to 600 watts and am using a NIVIDA 690.  I have been playing through the default game game and must say I have not had any problems at all. I can play the game on ultra graphic settings but, my processor gets buggy so I find that medium quality works very well for me. I have had ZERO crashes and only some slight stuttering a couple of times.  When I compare this game to the older Fallout games I can't think of anything that hasn't been improved upon. When FO3 first came out my game would crash almost every time I steped on a mine or got hit by a grenade? As far as I'm concerned Bethsoft has Swatted this one out ot the park, pun intended! 

This game has got to be added to TTW it is a perfect fit!! I'm willing to help out as much as I can however, I have no scripting skills at all. I'm just learning how to write code. That beeing said, I really would like to do something to help but, I want to wait until I've finished the FO4 main story line and quests. Then I will come back here to TTW again. I want to get a good feel for the vanilla FO4 before I start to mod it.

PS. I've noticed a lot of inclusions in FO4 to some of the mods that members here have created.  I don't want to put in any spoliers but, I think most of you ole timers like me will see them also.

All in all a great game and the best story line I've encounterd in a Fallout game yet!!

Thanks Bethsoft!

Restoring the greatest country in the world to its former glory, well, heh heh... Well, that takes time, even for the Enclave.

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FalloutAddict wrote:

FalloutAddict wrote:

I started playing FO4 the day it came out and have become throughly addicted.

No surprises there, I suppose. 

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AnvilOfWar wrote:

AnvilOfWar wrote:

 

I was excited at first.

Wow'd at the presentation Bethesda gave.

Preordered a Pip-boy version as soon as I could.

Gleeful at the install and start of the game.

Now, after about 3 hours of play (and 1 character restart) I am disappointed. The UI is horrible, truly the worst UI of any modern Bethesda game. Even Skyrim had a better UI for being so console centric. WASD the "E" key... and the "Enter" key? What octopus did Bethesda make this game for? And if your a lefty and map to the arrow keys, then it's the "tab" key is your culprit. :facepalm:

It's not all doom and gloom though, I haven't experienced any bugs in my playtime so far, so that's at least good.

Bethesda seemed to listen and not to complaints about the prior games for some things, the intro is fairly short (comparied to F3) however this is both a blessing and a curse in my mind. With not enough time to "bond" with your spouse, so right off the bat, I don't care for this protagonist's plight at all. One thing that threw me out of the game immersion wise was why would your character "thaw" for that brief moment in time to witness the said event? It makes no sense, and they seemingly go right back "under" to get put on ice right after?

Perhaps it's too early for a real judgement, I will try more, but color me very unimpressed so far.

Actually as I found out, you can press E instead of Enter most of the time. I haven't found any situation where that hasn't been the case.

I finished the story and I feel like the motivations make sense. I am just not sure what to do now. I suppose mods will fill that in.

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TTW, Tale of Three Wastelands


TTW, Tale of Three Wastelands!

Restoring the greatest country in the world to its former glory, well, heh heh... Well, that takes time, even for the Enclave.

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All I can say is that the

All I can say is that the "Lone Wanderer" perk has to be my favorite in the game.  I simply can't stand any gamebroken engine games with companions.  That said, I'm really enjoying this game and holding my breath past the bad parts till the GECK comes out.


"Teach a mutant to light a fire and he'll be warm for the night. Light a mutant on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of this life!"

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Damn this topic got more

Damn this topic got more attention than I thought

I ended up changing my review drastically to a more thorough, thought out one, I'll pull it up maybe later... Anyway, 4 hours was enough for me to want my money back, but I'll probably buy this when it goes on sale for like $20 and mods have fixed most of my technical problems. Sadly, the story and RPG problems can only be fixed if somebody replaced the setting with New Vegas.

 

 

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I am pretty sure I will

I am pretty sure I will receive Fallout 4 for Christmas and enjoy it.  And yes, I could have purchased it before but I have to be a good parent and be an example for my daughter.  But I am disappointed that Bethesda has learned nothing from Obsidian.  So are we back to the same conundrum as before?  Bethesda nails the world space, like they did with the CW, but needs Obsidian to convert the game into Fallout like FNV?

"TTW is the Fallout version of The One Ring. The One Ring to rule them all."

"Si vis pacem, para bellum!"

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Ok. I'm back with my second

Ok. I'm back with my second take on Fallout 4.

After some 25+ hours on this current game, I have reached my decision regarding this game.

Fallout 4 is a horrible RPG, but a decent shooter. Which is all it really is, a FPS with some RPG elements for flavor.

Choices are not your own. Bethesda has now proven to me that they don't care about player choice much if at all. Bethesda seems to not care or simply not be able to wrap their head around the idea that "no" is a valid response. Tell Preston that "your done here" and don't want to help his little band of refugees? Oh the game gives you the next part of the quest anyway. Why even give the player the option to say "no" if the game forces your hand and continues the set piece display anyway? Here you go get your power armor and go kill these raiders, when I'm thinking "actually, I'd like to mow down your little band of annoyance AND the raiders." Whoops, they are all essential can't fail that now can you? Fallout 3, Skyrim, and now Fallout 4 way too many essential characters to "demand" a story plays out in a certain fashion. Your character is a goodguy/girl or a slightly more sarcastic goodguy/girl.

Originally I was open to the idea that lacking skills might not be all that bad, on hindsight now and with the SPECIAL system as it is, I think it was a mistake. Special is now just a threshold for a perk, and ones level decides if you can upgrade your perks again. Where is the specialization/customization of a character? Get the Stat to the level to buy it and now... wait while you level up and have to take other things over time, it seems like they watered down the system. No more "ok I want to play as a scientist type and buy up all the skills/perks that make sense for that character/archetype." Now it's you leveled up, pick the one you want, and wait another 10~ levels to get the next tier, buying other things one might not even care about.

As someone that has played New Vegas into the ground and back logging more time on that game then likely anything else i have played in my lifetime (except an MMO). Fallout 4 is a massive letdown, in Fallout 3 I played until completion and gleefully went back for the DLC's. New Vegas played until i personally saw almost all the endings for each faction before I even modded it. And then played though each of the DLCs with even more glee. I can't even bring myself to go back and play this for one of the factions endings, let alone consider replaying the game. Saw the BoS Airship and remembered hearing myself groan at how over the top stupid it seemed to me, got my armor from them and the intro mission vs the super mutants and haven't played since.

Is it just me? Has anyone else just been so turned off by this game as to not even want to continue a game?

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it's not just you! The fact

it's not just you! The fact that you can't take two steps in the world without stumbling over a suite of PA bothers the hell out of me and don't even get me started on the "LEGENDARY" CRAP! 

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chucksteel wrote:

chucksteel wrote:

 

it's not just you! The fact that you can't take two steps in the world without stumbling over a suite of PA bothers the hell out of me and don't even get me started on the "LEGENDARY" CRAP! 

chuck, thank you for bringing that up. Power armor the thing that is one of the poster-boy's for Fallout in this version does not feel special, unique or even a reward. It's like a bowl of candy on the table "here have more" it seems to say. When raiders are walking around in semi working versions of what has always been classified as "rare and difficult to maintain gear" has made me loose any faith that "lore" was even looked at in passing.

"Legendary" random gear, what is this an MMO? Chasing some random number generator drop? I had my share of that over time, and can't stand it anymore.

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The biggest let down is that

The biggest let down is that it took Bethesda this many years to let us down more.  This reminds be of the DnD 4e drama.  Now they are back to the roots in 5e because Pathfinder was kicking their fan tail and probably still is.

"TTW is the Fallout version of The One Ring. The One Ring to rule them all."

"Si vis pacem, para bellum!"

My new favorite, the IWI TC-21 Tavor

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What I can say is this:

What I can say is this:

Bethesda forgets... It has a short memory or maybe a selective memory (not sure), here are the reasons why I say this:

  • Todd was always saying how him and the folks at Bethesda loved the original Fallout games when Beth got the Fallout IP.
    • But he seems to forget what Fallout 1 and 2 was all about as seen in a fans interview he answered back in FO3 days:
  • Morrowind was the last real RPG experience in a Bethesda game, after that each new game is more hand-holding, open world, exploration, action, adventure game, than the last one. They seem to forget what made Bethesda's RPGs good in the first place, also Beth was almost bankrupt once and was saved by Morrowind:
  • I point out to this little extract from that wall of text: "This is the game people want from us, this is the game we wanna do." So they knew Morrowind was the game people wanted 13 years ago, have we (gamers) gone so dumb that they have to make new games dumbed down so much like Skyrim and Fallout 4 or have Bethesda forgot what gamers want? Also an interesting note for all of those people that bash Morrowind fans (although I am sure there aren't many of those around here), if it wasn't for those fans Beth would have been closed down forever.
  • Bethesda actually forgets all negative points people point out or just forgets to read/listen to them in the first place.
  • Bethesda forgets they are not the greatest game developer in the world, so they seem to not try anymore.
  • Bethesda forgets what a real RPG game should be and feel like, I wouldn't complain as much as I do about FO4 if they have just said it was an action/shooter adventure open world game.
  • Bethesda forgets how to tell a story (doesn't matter if it is a good or bad story, again I keep using Morrowind to point out differences between Beth games because Morrowind didn't have a super awesome creative story, in fact it was a cliche hero saves the world but it was so well told).
  • Bethesda forgets the old fans and players, that loved Morrowind and made it a cult game and supported Beth in the times they were sinking badly, now those kind of players/fans are treated like sh*t if they open their mouth to just say one tiny bad critic about a tiny system/part of Beth games...
  • Bethesda seems to forget many players actually have brains and will notice bad things in their games (because I am sure they have so many fanboys/girls asking them to have anyone in Beth to wink at them or something that the voice of the displeased can't reach the high ears of the great Bethesda).
  • Bethesda seems to forget what it is to play a fun even if a bit complex RPG, the kind of RPGs they (well the core people at Bethesda, since I am sure now most of their employees and maybe even bosses never even played old computer RPGs) grew up playing and having fun with.
  • There are more but I already wrote a giant wall of text and I am also getting tired of "grumple" around... For closing I will just say this:

    • Bethesda lost to CD Projekt Red the 2015 Game Developer of the Year award
    • Bethesda Fallout 4 lost to CD Projekt Red The Witcher 3 the 2015 Best RPG of the Year award
    • Bethesda Fallout 4 lost to CD Projekt Red The Witcher 3 the 2015 Best Game of the Year award

    Hope this will give Bethesda the push to reality they really need so they can come back to earth and diminish their egos and pushes them to return to all they forgot and make good RPG games once again.

    Note: I have played and bought every Bethesda "big" games except for Arena and I love their games, but I also have eyes and I can see the games degenerate into a... I don't even know what to call them anymore. Makes me sad...

    RoyBatty
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    rabble rabble rabble

    rabble rabble rabble

    All I can add to this, how I feel has been stated already.

    KeltecRFB
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    Then Todd Howard is half the

    Then Todd Howard is half the problem.  I mean I can't totally thrash the guy because the world is great but the role playing sucks and I am not sure how responsible he truly is?  I mean he is the point guy so it is easy to trash him but is he really the main reason for bad role playing?

    "TTW is the Fallout version of The One Ring. The One Ring to rule them all."

    "Si vis pacem, para bellum!"

    My new favorite, the IWI TC-21 Tavor

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    It's not completely Howard,

    It's not completely Howard, he's just just trying to make games for the 66% of consumers, which is were the $$$ is, same as all companies. What they made was FAR  CRY 5 in all reality, just takes place after the nukes went off. Not picking on 3 and haven't played 4 but Far Cry 3 was consider Skyrim with gun so that's what Bethesda did..... were did you think the Legendary came from???? and the a gun that gives explosive damage??? are we playing Borderlands? They even admitted fallout 4 started as porting skyrim to the new consoles.

    But what really leaves me butt hurt about this is you take New Vegas and all the mods for it and have a team of paid professionals work on it for 5 years..... and fallout 4 face plants....????? Except to people that have never ran a mod on fallout 3 or NV, or as one of my friends came over and said playing fall out 3? I said no....... New Vegas... You should have seen his face when I sprinted... and use the grenade hot key.. LOL! But over all Bethesda!!!! You have taken every part of every game in the last 5 years that had high sales and made sure it was part of YOUR game. Then tired saying it's Fallout.......

    Honestly the first and best game that got me into RPGs was Morrwind, ON X-box, ya....

    After playing fallout 4 for 58, 10 hours in I kept going so when is it going to get better, maybe it picks up........30-After getting way to much fairy dust shit in my wasteland RPG and power armor laying all over and other BS, my fears were coming to light...... The only good thing about this game compared to my TTW modded game is (I believe) view distance and clutter. I can finally SNIPE!!!!!!!!! And the power armor feels a lot better than in the other games, like your a damn tank! So after typing this I'm going to go and Play some more TTW, Wasteland 2 DC, Dying Light, or any other games, but not fallout 4 until great mods that hopefully bring the game back to life. But I will not ever again buy another Bethesda game with in the first week again! If it was called something else and made by someone else 8/10 Bethesda you get a 6/10 because you had 7 years, and yet your research was done for you. Look on Nexus! the mods what most people want we should maybe think about putting in our game. BUT keep the RPG element.....

    chucksteel
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    This says it all! 
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    LOL!  Too funny Chuck!

    LOL!  Too funny Chuck!

    "TTW is the Fallout version of The One Ring. The One Ring to rule them all."

    "Si vis pacem, para bellum!"

    My new favorite, the IWI TC-21 Tavor

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    chucksteel wrote:

    chucksteel wrote:

     

    This says it all! 

    That's FO4 in a nutshell. I told a friend of mine that Bethesda made the perfect homeless simulator. Fallout 4, the game where you are excited to find aluminum cans.

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    There's a lot of things this

    There's a lot of things this game could be... there's a lot of things this game MAY be... but Fallout ain't none of 'em.  If Howard thought Fallout was as wonderful as he professes to have thought, where the hell did THIS come from?  I see a lot of people here, people a lot more knowledgeable than I am about games and gaming, expressing the same opinions I expressed from the get go.

    The way I am managing to "enjoy" this to the extent that I won't feel that I just tossed 60 bucks into the crapper is to completely ignore any connection anyone tries to make between it and the previous two games and pretend that this is yet ANOTHER totally separate timeline or dimension or alternate universe. 

    I'm used to 2 steps forward, 1 step back but this sudden leap sideways has me totally bleeped up.

     

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    I was browsing Facepunch and

    I was browsing Facepunch and someone called it a "Base building/ town building simulator with shooty bits tacked on" The story has Fallout 3's problem of them trying to let you be your character but forcing your character to be someone else for the sake of the plot. 

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    chucksteel wrote:

    chucksteel wrote:

    This says it all! 

    I love Zero Punctuation reviews.  He totally nailed it as usual.  His Skyrim review was great too.

    Risewild wrote:

    • Bethesda lost to CD Projekt Red the 2015 Game Developer of the Year award
    • Bethesda Fallout 4 lost to CD Projekt Red The Witcher 3 the 2015 Best RPG of the Year award
    • Bethesda Fallout 4 lost to CD Projekt Red The Witcher 3 the 2015 Best Game of the Year award

    I agree - CDProjektRED and their Witcher 3 for best studio and GOTY/Best RPG respectively.  Fallout 4 is solid but not the best game of the year. 

    If you take a look at Metacritic's top PC games for 2015, Fallout 4 isn't even in the top 10 - it's #26.  And if you sort the top 100 by user review instead of critic review you get rank #96 for Fallout 4. 

    To me, that says something about the mismatch between expectations (based on previous Fallout games) and what Bethesda actually delivered to the fans.

    ...

    Now that the new game honeymoon is over, people are realizing that Fallout 4 is a shooter, not an RPG, and is missing a lot compared to previous games - especially the standards set by New Vegas.  These things don't matter as much on your first playthrough when the world is new and exciting.  But then once you've explored everything, you're like, OK what's my replayability...  not much really.

     

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    Well my disappointment with

    Well my disappointment with Fallout 4 has driven me to roll all the way back to FO 1. I'm installing the Fixes mod, which I have never fully tried and am going to attempt to finish FO1, FO2 while I wait for FO4 patches and the New GECK. 

    I'm sure I will not get through even one game before jumping back into FO4 but we will see. 

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    Without mods FO4 is basically

    Without mods FO4 is basically a combination of simcity and a shooter for me. Id Tech guys probably decided to make comeback for their failed Rage game, and then Todd slapped Minecraft on top of it because why the heck not.

    With mods it can flourish though

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