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TrickyVein
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I see - yeah, MZ doesn't give

I see - yeah, MZ doesn't give you many choices.

Unless we had the aliens or abominations provide some things for you to combine with the biogel and expoy. That would also be pretty self-contained.

JaxFirehart
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I like the idea of the

I like the idea of the alcohols. Alien Cocktails!

Risewild
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Mmmm... Maybe I can make a

Mmmm... Maybe I can make a recipe to use some biogel and something else and make a fermented version as a drink .

Alien cocktails does sound great .

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Be nice if more food was on

Be nice if more food was on the market. Maybe add a caravan that specializes in trading Carrots, Apples, Brahmin Meat and so on. Would really help out. I've never really tried to make an NPC with that much scripting behind it though, so I don't know if you could just copy a template or what.

Another thought would be something like a food fabricator. You could find them in the diners of vaults, and they would work similarly to the Sierra Madre vending machines. The most likely currency for a system like that would probably be radroach meat. It's sort of easy to come by, it can be reasoned lore wise why it would operate on that and so on. The pay-out would be various pre-war foods.

Also, going way back, yeah. The first time you ever see Xander Root and Broc Flower in Fallout is up in Oregon in the Arefu settlement. They're most likely mutant plants, so they could go anywhere almost. Probably not some place like the Pitt.

If you really wanted to add a farm to Megaton, the most likely, and easiest crop for them would probably be Mushrooms. Just add a door to a damp underground area, like possibly a Drain Pipe that was exposed and broken open when the crater formed. Put various mushrooms around in there and that should work. It would give Megaton some reason to exist, outside of possibly also distilleries. That would be kind of an interesting little cash-in quest. Someone who pays you for empty bottles.

At any rate, DC has logic and design problems all over. But it does sort of make sense if you read too much into it. It's not about any one settlement self sustaining, it's about the caravans that supplement and supply everyone. Arefu sells the brahmin meat, Rivet City the vegetables, Megaton would be a natural fit for mushrooms and liquor. Then there are the smaller places that obviously only buy, like Tenpenny Tower, Temple of the Union, and so on.

It's been a long time since I posted anything, none of this probably makes sense or matters at this point lol

yukichigai
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Senterpat wrote:

Senterpat wrote:

What about jalepenos? I havent seen anyone mention them, peppers grow pretty much anywhere.

After poking around the internet for days I STILL cannot find any solid information on where Jalapenos do or do not grow naturally.  The information indicates that Jalapenos are "easy to grow", but it also mentions that they don't like cold climates, i.e. DC 5 months out of the year.  I suppose they could be cultivated.  Of course it doesn't say whether or not cold climates will kill the plant outright or just stop it from growing.  Plenty of plants do that, but given that Jalapenos are described as a "tropical" plant, I am skeptical.

As far as other harvestables/ingredients, Pinyon Nuts, Banana Yucca, Nevada Agave, Barrel Cactus, Honey Mesquite, and White Horsenettle are all straight out.  None of them can grow even as far east as Texas, much less DC.  Pinto Beans are another one I can't really find good information on, but my inkling is that they too will be confined to the Southwest US.

One thing that DID come up as okay though: Prickly Pear.  The Eastern Prickly Pear is known to grow as far North as Canada and is quite tolerant of cold climates.  It's technically a different species, but funnily enough I think it's actually the basis for the Prickly Pear which already exist in the game.  It certainly looks closer than any other variants I was able to pull up on Wikipedia.

 

So yeah, a little more to think about.

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What about PL's punga fruits?

What about PL's punga fruits? I don't believe those come back after being 'harvested' at least in vanilla (and from my last experience in V1.4). Though punga fruits in particular are somewhat exceptionally potent I can't help but feel that renewable resources permit extending a playthrough for quite some time.

@Ein

A food synthesizer sounds like an interesting concept, sort of a hybrid between OWB's Salient Green plant cloning and TP's ammo press. A prototype of that wouldn't be too difficult to throw together with a scripted vending machine and some campfire recipes.

Risewild
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Punga Fruit was to be made

Punga Fruit was to be made respawnable like the NV plants but for some reason it never seemed to respawn for me either .

pintocat
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The way the harvestable

The way the harvestable scripts work, they actually respawn on cell reset, which means if you've visited the cell, it resets the respawn timer again. The reason vendor chests still respawn is that the actual containers are in another cell usually.

Gribbleshnibit8 has a mod called Bountiful Harvest that fixes the scripts to actually run on a timer (checked on load, so you dont have thousands running constantly).His current version only supports vanilla NV stuff. I have one with DLC and TTW I'll upload here if he doesn't mind

frenzyslave
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You can always go underground

You can always go underground and cultivate that. Grow some subterranean harvests, like perhaps mushrooms or other edible fungi.

There may be no suitable land surrounding Megaton (and defensible), but there can always be a subterranean entrance WITHIN Megaton's defended walls.

Also, you don't have to stay lore-wise to harvestible foods/crops. There was a nuclear war, and this nuclear war caused Brahmin and Centaurs. I don't think it is even slightly off to add some mutated plant life, that has adapted to the environment, that is useful for harvesting. Hell, we even do genetic engineering right now.

After surviving a nuclear wasteland for over 150+ years, I think all supermarket food would be gone due to scavengers. How are people supposed to find something to eat? Find a harvestible edible/useful item, or experiment on ways to make Centaurs actually edible. A good cook can make anything edible - it doesn't have to taste great, lol.

Member of the People's Revolutionary Front of Canada and sworn enemy of their arch-rival: The Canadian People's Front. Hoping for a Fallout game around the Great Lakes... Highly unlikely ever, but why dreams exist.

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I did some brief research

I did some brief research into native plants to the DC area that would grow in dry soil, and might be interesting to have in TTW.

New Jersey Tea (Redroot) -

Kentucky Coffee Tree

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JaxFirehart
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Well, first, we would need

Well, first, we would need these plants modeled and textured, then they would need to be hand placed. So don't bother for now, but if anyone reads this who is capable of creating these assets, I would be all for it.

CourierSix
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Horsemint is near identical

Horsemint is near identical (in model) to White Horsenettle (http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/White_horsenettle) if that helps at all. :)

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JaxFirehart
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That does indeed help!

That does indeed help!

CourierSix
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Can I make the case for

Can I make the case for Xander Root and Broc Flower? It may have been said before, but they don't seem overly western, especially not Xander Root, as it's a root vegetable that grows in dry grounds. It seems to me like anywhere grass could grow, these could too. (In Ireland, there's an island called the Aran Islands. The island is too inhospitable to grow anything - except root crops, which survive the horrible mid-atlantic storms and overly salty soil). A lot of the Mojave wildlife is native, and couldn't be ported, but I feel without these two, or something similar, we're leaving a large hole open in crafting.

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JaxFirehart
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The Broc Flower and Xander

The Broc Flower and Xander Roots have to date ONLY appeared on the west coast. But the same could be said of deathclaws.

You made a good case for xander roots, but where did they originate? How did they migrate?

With broc flowers, same questions, what makes you think they would be at home in the colder, wetter DC climate?

I'm not against the inclusion and would actually approve of the inclusion, but I want good logically-sound reasons why.

For example, Xander Root says it is SIMILAR to an onion. Now that's not much to go on, but onions are actually widely grown in the Northeast Coastal region. Maybe we assume it IS a mutated onion and therefore FEV mutated it similarly in both regions. Etc.

CourierSix
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Well, after the nuclear

Well, after the nuclear winter that must have proceeded the Great War, all plants and animals would have evolved in a similar way (divergent evolution - two similar species in similar environments will ultimately evolve the same way). A root vegetable, especially an onion, would have been grown all over the country - they're fairly hardy vegetables.

As for Broc Flower, we could semi-safely assume that the Brotherhood of Steel (who already aren't fond of adaptation) would be likely to bring along whatever they used back West. And given the amount of extra radioactive waste in DC, the temperature's should be assumed to be higher than they are now (without going into loads of detail, radioactive decay gives off energy as well as radioactive particles - and that energy has to go to somewhere, usually in the form of heat). Maybe not mojave heat levels, but remember that in the Mojave Broc Flower is primarily found in shady areas, such as near caves, or near hills. (http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Broc_flower_(Fallout:_New_Vegas). I'm not an expert on plant life or anything, but I presume that means it likes colder areas, or at least areas with less sunlight (due to the fact it's found in hilly/rocky areas, it also means it's used to bad soil, and plants especially have done quite well in Chernobyl.)

I can't think of anything else, but these reasons make sense in my head. But then again, I am trying to find excuses to justify it, so maybe I'm just trying to fit evidence around the conclusion rather than trying to come to a conclusion from the evidence.

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JaxFirehart
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I did a bit of research and

I did a bit of research and the Broc Flower is most closely related to lilies. Especially Wood Lilies, its actually a pretty close resemblance. They are not commonly found in California, but are found in Arizona, New Mexico and DC. So the Broc Flower is probably an evolved Wood Lily.

Xander Roots are actually harder to place, the three little tails coming off the bulb make it unique, and the bulb itself looks like any other. Radishes, Onions, Garlic and similar root vegetables all have the same basic shape, minus the tails. Considering what FEV does to animals the Xander Root could have come from anywhere.

Point is, between my research and yours, I see no reason not to include them, so long as nobody comes along and gives good reason not to. 

CourierSix
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Cool :D I completely agree

Cool :D I completely agree with how thorough you're being on this, but being a survivalist character myself, it's rather hard to not have those two ingredients. And we could use those perhaps as a base for some DC specific recipes - for example, a healing poultice type thing, but with a punga fruit added - it would have the added benefit of scrubbing radiation, as radiation is a much bigger problem in 3 than it ever was in NV.

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Just read through this thread

Just read through this thread and noticed talk of a food synthesizer. I put together a script for a plant-matter cloning device quite a while ago, the idea was that you could add a single sample of plant material (25 different types) and after that it would regularly produce a clone. It works fine but needs some changes made (it only produces once every 3 days, can't remember whether clones stack or not.) Anyway, if it'd be any help as a base for someone to work with, I'm happy to share it.

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As far as placement goes,

As far as placement goes, there could be a greater concentration of plants around the edges of the Potomac, and its dried beds, and under water towers. With that in mind, I think the Broc flower and xander root could stand to be in DC. I don't think there is any harm in it, but with it should come a greater number of campfires placed around the areas as well. I assume that'll be a thing as time goes by. I don't think that organized agriculture should be a big thing so much as attempts at it. There is a farm or two, but most of em have failed. I definitely like the idea of having Mutfruit out there though.

JaxFirehart
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Yeah we've known it needs

Yeah we've known it needs more campfires for a while, just some dry work

As a stop gap I made the optional plugin for usable camp grills and BBQs

TrickyVein
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Which works really well, by

Which works really well, by the way. 

JaxFirehart
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Credit goes to Yukichigai, he

Credit goes to Yukichigai, he has an almost identical mod on the Nexus that I basically remade

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How about making the River

How about making the River City Hydroponics good for some thing?

They could be a source of fruits and vegetables.

They could also have salvaged some rare plants at some point.

Always bring a companion or two that is slower than you.
Because you don't need to out run a Deathclaw.
You just need to out run your companions (Just bring a lot of companions in case the Deathclaw is really hungry!).

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Where are the Rivet City

Where are the Rivet City Hydroponics?

The Unspeakable...
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They're mentioned in Dr. Li's

They're mentioned in Dr. Li's terminal in the Science Lab. I don't think they have a physical location in-game.

"The RC hydroponics have been restored to basic functionality - easy enough after all our research. The limited amount of clean water we can produce is enough for growing basic foodstuffs.

Still no progress on any mass-purification tests, and with all of the maintenance that has to be done around here, there's hardly any time to attempt new experiments.

In any case, RC wouldn't work as a location for truly large scale decontamination. The infrastructure just isn't here, and the idea of recreating it again is too daunting to convince the rest of the council.

And that's even if the process worked."

Bellum... bellum nunquam mutatur...

Risewild
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Well I guess that shows that

Well I guess that shows that RC can't produce a large quantity of fresh food.

Casputin
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Maybe enough to sustain the

Maybe enough to sustain the city though? I still like the idea of a modest hydroponic farm on the flight deck. Just my 2 cents.

TJ
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http://www.nexusmods.com

http://www.nexusmods.com/fallout3/mods/11900/?

This looks like it would work...

"In the world of entertainment, there are very few things as good..... as Fallout."

"... That's why we're going out of our way to make our game less Fallout."

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Building in the things above

Building in the things above but trying to provide something new how factible would be to expand upon the sink's (OWB) farming capabilities by adding space for new plants?

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frenzyslave wrote:

frenzyslave wrote:

You can always go underground and cultivate that. Grow some subterranean harvests, like perhaps mushrooms or other edible fungi.

There may be no suitable land surrounding Megaton (and defensible), but there can always be a subterranean entrance WITHIN Megaton's defended walls.

I agree with this logic and, moreover, it makes sense.  All settlements need water, but only in Megaton and Rivet City do you find so much emphasis put on them (still new to FO3, so if I am mistaken, correct me), Megaton putting the most emphasis on it.

Would make sense from a acreage/defense standpoint to have an underground cave that the townsfolk (for good reason) do not mention to strangers.  Not limited to just fungi though, a working greenhouse 'planters' like the ones in Vault 88 and/or Point Lookout's Cathedral.  This would also explain more about the large pipes.

In fact, adding a 'simple' (not a texture of modeler guy, so this is a guess) glow splotch to a section of ceiling in the cave directly under the bomb could show the bomb's radiation leaking down to serve as a sort of subterranean 'sun' which helps the plants grow in lieu of the greenhouse lighting from Vault 88.  Not trying to start any sort of religious debate/discussion here, but many primitive religions included 'sun worship, as the sun made crops grow.  Could mesh well with the Church of Atom's beliefs even though they never outright say "This gift helps our crops grow below!", right?

Explaining it in-game to the player/character would be as 'simple' as them finding the access hatch(s) and going down there, finding either a voiced farmer who explains and asks the LW to swear to secrecy, and/or a terminal/holotape that gives a history of Megaton's farm cave stemming from its accidental discovery, to clearing it of animal life, etc.,  This secrecy would make sense defense-wise, in my opinion, as "Hey!  Megaton has water AND a Mega-Farm!" would paint it as a BIGGER target for raiders, whereas "Megaton has water!" as it is, already draws enough attention, per the existing dialogue.

The way I picture it is they could not only have the planters, but also a couple of brahmin pens down there, with a food processor (mentioned above) and an access hatch leading up into the Brass Lantern (for both cover and convenience).  Moriarty, for obvious reasons, is kept out of the loop on the whole thing and it plays into his already-present disdain for the Lantern, if you think about it.

Just offering suggestions on how to make it feasable *and* lore-friendly while keeping 'major' changes to a minimum.

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