In January 2014, I finally got off my bum and set up donations for the site.
Yes that's right, here is a PayPal button!
Donations so far (goal is $2500/year to cover hosting costs)
* the above stats were updated December 31, 2016.
Frequently Asked Questions:
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Why donations?
Well, first off a lot of people have asked if they can donate. Also, it costs a lot of money to run this site, and I've been paying out of my own pocket for the last two years (see below). So I set up an LLC and so forth to handle donations.
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Why an LLC and not a non-profit entity (non-profit corporation, etc.)?
I did consider this, but I went with an LLC because it provides better liability protection for me personally, as well as other users of the site. Plus, it's a whole lot simpler to set up. Also, the LLC gives the "operating at a loss" situation a bit of a silver lining. If I don't raise enough money each year to cover the costs, with the LLC, I can write off the loss against my taxable income.
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But I thought you were rich or something?
Not really that rich, actually - just generous. And if I have the opportunity to cover some of the costs, then that's great. Plus, it's a big bill to pay come November (see below).
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Why donations and not ads?
A couple of reasons. 1) Donations are optional, ads are mandatory; 2) A lot of people block ads; and 3) A lot of ads spy on the site and its users. No thanks.
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Where does my money go?
Payments go to a PayPal account for the LLC. Account info and transactions in the account will be posted quarterly (no emails or names will be shared, just summary information) so you can see how much money I "make" on this and how much it offsets the costs. You can see the results attached to this post, below.
Where your money ultimately goes is for paying our service providers (Dreamhost and iflychat.com) for the web hosting and chat (respectively). The server is quad-core, 4GB ram, 500GB HDD space, Raid 1, with unlimited bandwidth. TTW's site averages about 10 GB of data transfer a DAY so unlimited bandwidth and a dedicated server is pretty much mandatory. The chat is capped at 60 simultaneous users.
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What do I get for my donation?
Nothing! ABSOLUTELY NOTHING! Well maybe an icon on your forum posts that shows you've donated. That's about it though. This is strictly out of the goodness of your heart - you can still download TTW, or use the site, or whatever without donating.
Oh and if you do donate, send me a PM and I can add the little "Donor" icon to your forum post panel (see mine to the left).
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How much do I have to donate?
At least one cent. Otherwise, PayPal won't let you donate. However, with a one cent donation, your money goes straight to paypal because of the fee.
Note that I reserve the right to NOT add the "Donor" icon if you donate a microscopic amount, such as one cent. A few people have donated this amount, and then PM'd me for their "Donor" badge. Nice try. Please donate $5 or more if you want the badge.
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I've been here for years helping out with development, and I don't feel like donating because I think I've put in my time. Problem?
That's fine; again, donations are totally optional. If I find anyone pressuring anyone else into donating, I will rain fire on your asses.
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I am rich and I want to donate $1,000 but I want to become a moderator, or some other such deal. Will you do it?
No. You can donate as much as you want, but it won't get you anything extra.
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Can I get a refund on that donation?
Yes, but if it turns into a big hassle for me I will just refund your money and then ban you from the site.
Imagine taking your money and setting it on fire. That is what you are doing. If you don't want to do that, don't donate in the first place.
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Don't you share this server with other sites? Shouldn't they be donating too?
Yep, and they are. On average, TESrenewal.com (formerly morroblivion.com) and TaleOfTwoWastelands.com use up about 95% of the server's bandwidth. It's a race! Donate more than the other guys. Or whatever.
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What happens if you get more than you need? Will you stop taking donations? Will you keep the money for yourself (you jerk)?
If, by some miracle, people donate more than ~$2500/year, then the excess will stay in the bank account / PayPal account to be used for future server costs. Or, if we just have a shit ton of money, the excess will be donated to a charity after a vote on what charity (or charities) it should go to. Pie in the sky, but it's good to have a plan I guess.
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Will donating make TTW development happen any faster?
NO! Donating only really helps pay for our web hosting. If you can, WE WOULD MUCH RATHER HAVE YOU TO DONATE YOUR TIME - that is, learn to use the GECK and FNVedit and help with the project. There are tons of tutorials out there, many of which are linked in the FAQ. If you are a hard worker and self-directed learner (or interested in acquiring these valuable skills) and also interested in learning how to mod and develop video games, this is a great project to work on.
Here are some numbers:
2012 expenses:
- 2012-07-24: $214.80 - Dreamhost Shared Hosting (paid ahead for 2 years of hosting)
- 2012-09-11: $59.70 - Domain Registration (six domains for TTW, including taleoftwowastelands.com/.net/.org and twowastelands.com/.net/.org, at $9.95/year)
- 2012-10-23: $6.66 - Dreamhost VPS trial / upgrade, for service through 2012-10-23
- 2012-11-03: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2012-11-06: $1859.00 - Dreamhost Dedicated Server (Blue Moon 4 Dedicated) - $169/mo, with 1 mo. free if billed annually (note that multiple sites share this server, but TTW.com uses about half the bandwidth)
- 2012-11-08: -$183.27 - Refund on unused balance of Shared Hosting plan
- 2012-12-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
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- 2012 grand total: $1994.89 - paid by me
2013 expenses:
- 2013-01-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2013-02-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2013-03-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2013-04-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2013-05-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2013-06-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2013-07-03: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2013-08-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2013-09-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2013-09-10: $135.40 - Domain Registration (six domains for TTW, including taleoftwowastelands.com/.net/.org and twowastelands.com/.net/.org, at $11.95 for .com and .net, and $9.95 for the two .org domains), all two year renewals
- 2013-10-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2013-11-03: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2013-11-06: $1859.00 - Dreamhost Dedicated Server (Blue Moon 4 Dedicated) - $169/mo, with 1 mo. free if billed annually (note that multiple sites share this server, but TTW.com uses about half the bandwidth)
- 2013-12-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
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- 2013 grand total: $2222.40 - paid by me
2014 expenses:
- 2014-01-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2014-02-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2014-03-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2014-04-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2014-05-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2014-06-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2014-07-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2014-07-22: $15.00 - SSL certificate
- 2014-08-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2014-09-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2014-10-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2014-11-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2014-12-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
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- 2014 misc bills: $243 total paid by me - consider this my "donation" to support the site
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- 2014-11-13: $1859.00 - Dreamhost Dedicated Server (Blue Moon 4 Dedicated) - $169/mo, with 1 mo. free if billed annually (note that multiple sites share this server, but TTW.com uses about half the bandwidth)
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- 2014 hosting: $1859.00 - paid by the donors - thank you!!!
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- 2014 grand total = $2102
2015 expenses:
- 2015-01-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2015-02-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2015-03-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2015-04-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2015-05-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2015-06-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2015-07-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2015-07-16: $15.00 - SSL certificate
- 2015-08-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2015-08-11: $135.40 - Domain Registration (six domains for TTW, including taleoftwowastelands.com/.net/.org and twowastelands.com/.net/.org, at $11.95 for .com and .net, and $9.95 for the two .org domains), all two year renewals
- 2015-09-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2015-10-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2015-11-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2015-12-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
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2015 misc bills: $378.40 total paid by me - consider this my "donation" to support the site
(Note that this doesn't include state and federal taxes on donations that occurred in 2014, which I paid myself in 2015. I estimate these to be around $1000 total, or about $500 each, shared between the two sites, but it is difficult to get an exact figure as I am the sole member of the LLC and therefore the taxable income "flows through" and is merged with my personal income filing - turbotax takes care of the rest. So, I'm paying the taxes myself for two reasons: so everything is nice and legal, and so donations stay in PayPal instead of being used to pay taxes) - -
- 2015-11-24: $1859.00 - Dreamhost Dedicated Server (Blue Moon 4 Dedicated) - $169/mo, with 1 mo. free if billed annually (note that multiple sites share this server, but TTW.com uses about half the bandwidth)
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- 2015 hosting: $1859.00 - paid by the donors - thank you!!!
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- 2015 grand total: $2237.40
2015 expenses:
- 2016-01-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2016-02-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2016-03-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2016-04-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2016-05-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2016-06-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2016-07-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2016-07-17: $15.00 - SSL certificate
- 2016-08-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
- 2016-08-11: $0.00 - Domain Registration - paid for 2-year renewals back in 2015!
- 2016-09-02: $19.00 - iflychat.com monthly chat service
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2015 misc bills: $186.00 total paid by me - consider this my "donation" to support the site
(Note that this doesn't include state and federal taxes on donations that occurred in 2015, which I paid myself in 2016. I estimate these to be around $500 total, or about $250 each, shared between the two sites, but it is difficult to get an exact figure as I am the sole member of the LLC and therefore the taxable income "flows through" and is merged with my personal income filing - turbotax takes care of the rest. So, I'm paying the taxes myself for two reasons: so everything is nice and legal, and so donations stay in PayPal instead of being used to pay taxes) - -
- 2016-11-24: $1859.00 - Dreamhost Dedicated Server (Blue Moon 4 Dedicated) - $169/mo, with 1 mo. free if billed annually (note that multiple sites share this server, but TTW.com uses about half the bandwidth)
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- 2016 hosting: $1859.00 - paid by the donors - thank you!!!
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- 2015 grand total: $2045.00
This is a good thing and you deserve to get something back for all your efforts Therm. Once I get out of the hole I'm in I will kick in and I'm sorry but I expect to be made a moderator! If not Admin!
TTW Interiors
Beantown Interiors
(joker: on) Can i be the president of the United Wastelands if i give you something????? :) (joker: off)
Video games are bad for you? That's what they said about rock'n'roll...
I'm new to the site and so far i really like the work you've done. I'm setting up a new playthrough of FO3 and TTW is definitely going to be the way I go. I made a donation, put my money where my mouth is type of thing. It ain't much considering how much of your own cash you put into this, but it's something.
Deficio es non en bene
Every little bit helps.
"In the world of entertainment, there are very few things as good..... as Fallout."
"... That's why we're going out of our way to make our game less Fallout."
X)
If you donate, and don't bother putting your TTW/ Morro username in the 'username' field on the donation page and also don't send therm a PM he'd have no way of knowing what user the donation came from. I'm sure he'd rather you do both and in the PM request to not have the donor badge added.
"In the world of entertainment, there are very few things as good..... as Fallout."
"... That's why we're going out of our way to make our game less Fallout."
Indeed, there are already a bunch of unidentified donors. I even search each email address to see if it matches with a user on the site. Usually it doesn't. :shrug:
X)
thermador wrote:
My paypal's in my wife's name, but I let you know when I donated.
"In the world of entertainment, there are very few things as good..... as Fallout."
"... That's why we're going out of our way to make our game less Fallout."
Well, someone (with the initials DG) donated $100 yesterday, but didn't give me a user name, and their paypal email address doesn't match up with any accounts on the site.
So thank you very much DG! If you want the "donor" logo on your account, just send me a PM.
can you put a note about "enter your ttw-name" before going into the PayPal screen?
And if you did, make it bigger?
Once in paypal I'm just looking at amounts and hitting pay...
then I saw the ttw name note, but page was already going away.
I just recently discovered TTW (within the last month or so), and I'm amazed by it.
Currently playing through the FO3 campaign again.... ahh, memories. :)
I've donated, because this is a project I would love to keep around.
Thanks for the donations everyone. First post updated.
Unfortunately I can't change the way PayPal sets up their forms, so if you forget to fill out the part with your user name, please send me a PM.
End of month update; thanks everyone :D
Damn, TESRenewal is creaming us...
READ BEFORE ASKING FOR HELP
Yeah but they usually use more than half the bandwidth, and usually have about 2x the number of people on chat.
I sorta feel like an @$$hole now for donating a micro amount! I'll send you guy's some more!
Bye Guys.
Thanks zenmaster
im with ya Zenmaster this team has been awesome. i get better customer support from here than i do on the things i've been required to pay for and need it less cause the product is more stable. :)
i know i'll be giving more as soon as i am able.
THANK YOU TTW TEAM!
asus ROG laptop, specs: i5 3230 3.2, 8gb ram, nvidia gtx 660, Window 8 64 bit, logitech surround + sony xplode 250 car amp powering two 12inch 120 watts sub (wal-mart specials), sound system by freakenstein
Monthly update - thanks everyone! At this point we are more than ready for the hosting bill in November. I never thought it would be this quick!
thermador wrote:
That's because all of you and TTW are awesome! Besides, you shouldn't have to foot the server costs for all of us.
"TTW is the Fallout version of The One Ring. The One Ring to rule them all."
"Si vis pacem, para bellum!"
My new favorite, the IWI TC-21 Tavor
Awesome Thermador!
"In the world of entertainment, there are very few things as good..... as Fallout."
"... That's why we're going out of our way to make our game less Fallout."
Gribbleshnibit8 wrote:
Is there anything you have in mind?
teamspeack chat or voice chat would be nice thermador because i like to talk to fellow player and you could have a donate rooms so there no random users in the chat
it was a segetsipn not a requested don't get you under where in notes
READ BEFORE ASKING FOR HELP
I just think a ts sever would be nice to have of ttw players
Well IIRC people can make their own TS servers (I can't be sure since I stopped using TS years ago), so if anyone around here would want to make one for TTW community I see nothing wrong with it. But I doubt any Dev or team member would show up there.
Read:
Monthly update, thanks everyone!
TESRenewal mopped the floor with us!
"In the world of entertainment, there are very few things as good..... as Fallout."
"... That's why we're going out of our way to make our game less Fallout."
Looking at the forum posts, it seems like we're a larger community too. I guess we're just saving our money for the nuclear apocalypse.
No they typically have double the number of people on their chat. It's definitely a larger community. No worries.
Haha okay. Regardless, it's nice that you'll be getting some/all of your money back!
Monthly update, thanks everyone!
Therm I know these are set up as "donations", Would it be possible if someone wanted to do a "subscription"? As in pay $x per month to help offset expenses.
EDIT: D'oh!! Ok there is a recurring/monthly option via Paypal so to answer my own question this is something that can be setup. Thanks Term!!!!
If life is but a test, where's the damn answer key?!?!?
Nice, that's good to know, I've been thinking about doing that. Been donating what I can the last 3 paydays, just because I love TTW and want to show my appreciation for all the hard work you guys have put into this. Thanks guys.
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Switched from monthly to quarterly updates since the pace of donations has slowed somewhat. So here is the quarterly update (see first post) - there is enough money in the bank account to pay the annual hosting bill next month, and to pay the November 2015 webhosting bill as well!
I keep logging turned off to keep the site as fast as possible (and I don't use google analytics due to the privacy issues), but Dreamhost provides some summary data transfer totals for the last 30 days. Last month, TTW transferred an average of 8.6 GB per day via http, and 21.8 GB per day via https. That adds up to about 940GB per month, or about 11 terrabytes a year.
Thanks for supporting the site everyone
Updated for year-end 2014 - thank you donors!
Umm yeah paypal and just dealing with internet transactions in general has pissed me off in the past so is there any way I can get a confirmation by you gentlemen to know when my donation to you has actually been processed / received?
Perhaps an email as confirmation?
Keep up the good work guys.
Data and charts updated. Sorry it's been so long this time. But we have enough in the bank now to cover the server bills in both November 2015 and November 2016, so we have plenty of money for hosting for the next two years. Alright alright alright.
Thanks to all the donors!
How do I donate in £???
Briggs, from my experience, Paypal would be your best bet? There could be others but I have never used them.
Paypal FAQ on sending/receiving money across the globe
Also, Thermador included a Paypal donation button at the top.
"TTW is the Fallout version of The One Ring. The One Ring to rule them all."
"Si vis pacem, para bellum!"
My new favorite, the IWI TC-21 Tavor
Okay, sorted! and done! Thanks
Updated yet again after paying the annual hosting bill this morning. Still have enough in paypal to keep things afloat through November 2018.
Thanks to all the donors!
Updated for 2016 year end. Thanks again to all the donors!
Since we are using Discord for our chat service now, I cancelled the chat hosting plan in September. Of course, we could also remove it from the site completely, which would have the added benefit of speeding up the site for logged-in users.
As you may notice, donations are slowing considerably. It appears there are two factors:
- TTW donations were very weak last year, most likely due to the release of Fallout 4 in late 2015, and delays in releasing TTW v3.0 which should be out mid-2017.
- TES donations were less than the last few years, most likely as people are fatigued in waiting for Skywind to see the light of day.
That said, we still have enough in PayPal for the November 2017 hosting bill, and are well on our way toward the November 2018 bill as well.